Hey everybody. Taking a break from the True Colors hype. Hope you're enjoying the song and I sincerely hope you're praying its popularity grows. We'll get back to it shortly....just had to deal with something disgusting. Know what I mean? Time to vent...tired of crackpot clergymen.
The question is.."Is he a minister or a maniac?" Good question, right? What I find deplorable are preachers, especially pastors, who call themselves men of God but they continue to tear up the church, the Lord's body. Spreading rumors. Sharing gossip. Tearing down the reputation of another Christian brother or sister. Using sermons as a personal assault weapon and tactic. Supposed to be sharing the Word of God, but attacking God's people with his mouth. Not up front, but secretly. Cowardly. Too devilish to admit he's a pathological liar. Sowing discord among the brethren! I'm sure we've all had the not so distinct pleasure of fellowshipping with a pastor who needed to have his head examined.
Is he Godly or is he gangsta?
My peeps...what could be more diabolical than a pastor who won't admit he's the reason good people leave the church? Not just good people, but Godly people. Instead of coming clean, he sets the stage for others to take the fall and bear the blame. Why? So he can appear innocent?
God knows. We do too.
It's unfortunate, but many pulpits are being occupied by dressed up demons, manipulating the Word of God to launch assaults against parishioners thirsting for God's truths. Like God will back him up because he used Scripture. Bruh -man better rethink the plan. God doesn't back up a nutcase who rips Scripture from its context and uses it as pretext to get his own opinion across. Raping the Word of God to satisfy a demented mindset.
Am I angry? Ummm....whaddya think?
But why so hostile, Sid? I'm exhausted yawl. Tired of seeing good people taking the heat for someone else's craziness. Destroying families. Tearing up marriages. Mad with married couples who get along with each other. What's the problem? Wuzzup with a PASTOR tearing up a family? Thought a pastor's job was to reconcile? It's demonic....no other way to explain it.
Is he a minister or a maniac?
If he's a minister, then he should minister, not manhandle and maneuver. We gotta keep these men of God in prayer before God does something that everyone will talk about. A proverb. A byword. A parable. If these so-called men of God will not straighten up and straighten up quick, God might just use them to teach others what NOT to do. And we do not wish to see that. May these preachers see the error of their ways and repent. God's house is no place to play.
Love yawl
Stay tuned and stay prayerful
Your brother,
Sid
Hey brother Sid,
ReplyDeleteFirst off how r u doing? In response to your comment I think I will say that it is easy for us to see the fault in others and believe that we have it all together. Most Christians have a hard time when it comes to not only hearing the word, but leaning, depending and trusting in the word, and that goes for everything that we face in our life, rather or not it be a wicked preacher, minister, deacon, etc. The bible clearly states that we are to let the wheat n tare grow together n allow him to do the seperating. Our role( and I think u touched on it is to pray)we r living in times of apostasy n the time of God's return is not getting further but nearer. We should not allow what others do in the church to cause us to lose site of God's purpose for us individually and as a whole...We are many member but of the same body. If we learn how to love like God would have us to... we could then talk to and pray for the hurting person before it becomes to late..Instead in the church we have people who talk to people who talk to people and who talk to other people who r have not or r not even apart of the whole picture. Pray u understand... my point is dont ridicule or point the finger.. if u see a problem we all must learn to pray before talking to anyone else about it..after all he is ultimately the only one who can really work it out...Be encouraged n tell the wife hello :)
T.L.C
ReplyDeleteAppreciate the post. However, I would never think I have it all together. Far from it. And my previous posts on the Church Folk blog confirms that. Good observation, though. As far as the Word, God has taught me to eat the meat and spit out the bones. Doesn't matter who is talking. As far as the wheat and the tare, that's a distinction between Christians and the world. So, am I to assume we believe the preacher is unsaved? Good point. Christ will do the separating - sheep versus goats. Christians versus non-Christians. Perhaps the ministers aren't saved....not my call. Don't have an eye sharp enough to see that.
The Bible also says that because of Peter's hypocrisy, the Apostle Paul rebuked him publicly (cf. Gal 2:11) Peter's deviation from the truth caused clashes in the church. And the consequence was that a solid believer (i.e. Barnabas) was carried away in his hypocrisy. Keeping quiet when sin is running rampant in the camp is equal to condoning it. Can't do that. Now, could my tone have been a little better? Yep...ya got me on that one. And for that, I apologize.
Have I done what Paul did? No. Don't feel led to rebuke the preacher in public. Won't call names, because that isn't necessary. And did you HIT the nail on the head concerning apostasy. For real on that one. You must have been reading 2 Timothy 4...smile.
God's purpose is in the forefront of my mind. Haven't lost sight of that. But I am acutely aware of what He hates (cf. Proverbs 6:19) Can't have love without discipline. That includes me...if I'm out of line, I expect a spanking. And as far as the hurting person, too much has happened to simply pray that away. There is going to be a need for some serious counseling on that...seriously.
And you are spot on again. People talk to people and talk to other people. You hit that one, for real. Not ridiculing or pointing the finger. I'm fruit inspecting. Jesus said a good tree can't bring out bad fruit (cf. Luke 6:43-45) and Paul chimed in by saying that those who cause offenses contrary to doctrine must be marked and avoided (cf. Romans 16:17) And when one teaches one thing and does another, one sends the wrong message.
And the prayers are still going up for the brethren who stand in danger of God's wrath. I'm praying we all get it together.
Now, I know not a lot of people can stomach me, and I understand that. But someone else needed it. Have already heard from them. On the verge of a nervous breakdown and was glad someone could understand. But good conversation.
Appreciate you. Told the wife...hey
Scribe
My Brother you have walked this message. Too many churches have been afflicted by horrible leadership using the excuse that the so called minister cannot be questioned in his wrong doing. Keep telling the truth, there is no where in the Bible that says we are supposed to obey a man when the man himself is a disgrace. A good pastor would leave a church rather than tear it apart. Most Godly people who truly worship Christ want nothing to do with a man like that and rightly so. When you are in a church where the spirit of idolatry is stronger than the spirit of Christ you are in a bad place. Colossians 3:23,24 states: Whatever you do, do your work heartily, as for the Lord rather than men....It is the Lord Christ whom you serve. A great man of God would not want man worship as a matter of fact no man of God should want a church to "do what I say"....it should be do what Christ says do. We were raised to study the word for ourself to show thine ownself approved. If more so called Christians would do that no Gangsta preacher could tear down the body of Christ. What kind of person sees good, Godly people leave the church of there birth, the church they and there families have worshiped in all there lives and not care that they are reason the people left? Minister or Maniac. I say MANIAC. Minister of Maniacdome. A Godly, True Pastor, Reverend, would care. So you say it my brother and say it loud.
ReplyDeleteMy Brother Sid. So true, so true. There is a scripture in Proverbs that say Open rebuke is better than secret love...So to rebuke is not a bad thing. On the other hand when I read your blog titled "Is he a Minister or a Maniac" I thought about James 4th chapter,From whence come fightings among you..LUST, PRIDE. Worldliness in the House of God. But the verse that stands out for me is the 17th verse. To know to do good and you don't do it; it is a sin. And II Peter 2: 21 It would be better had he not known than to know. (Paraphrased) Oh MANIAC knows exactly what he is doing. But it would have been better for him to not know the way of righteousness. Brother Sid I could say more but it would be too too long. I don't want to bore anybody. But keep writing, I'll continue to pray for you and your wife. This was a great one for me because I could not have said it any better. I really and truly enjoy reading them very much. I love the song.
ReplyDeletePeace
Really quite disappointing to see ‘church folk’ show more respect for the president than for a minister. In fact some would even say it is hypocritical. If a man of God has fallen into sin, a loving brother would follow scripture. One: go to the man of God and help him. Two: if he won’t hear take a witness. Three: if he still won’t hear go before the church. If that should fail, which it can't because it is God’s Word, what kind of love would allow a maniac, false prophet, lair, and gansta to continue to mislead others? Its time ‘church folk’ stop covering up and walking away from sin and deal with it. 1Peter 3:9-11
ReplyDeleteWell...gotta hit it again, yawl. LesRee and Household both know what I'm talking about, but allow me to address Anonymous.
ReplyDeleteA minister is held to a higher standard than the President. The President is a political leader. The preacher is supposed to be a shepherd, and not one that lords over his flock. Supposed to be feeding the flock and being an example to the flock (cf. 1 Peter 5:2-3). What kind of example does a shepherd show who blatantly destroys the church, despite being warned? The President leads the country. Preachers are supposed to lead people into eternal life. Which office holds more weight? Which office is held more accountable to God?
Maybe some would say it's hypocritical, others would not. Who's right? Furthermore, how does Anonymous know the steps he or she quoted in Matthew 18 weren't taken? Secondly, Anonymous misquotes the Scripture. Let's look at it.
"If that should fail, which it can't?"
Not what it says, my brother or sister. Second half of Vs. 17 says, if he neglects to hear the church, let him be unto thee as a heathen man and a publican." Check that out. Where in that text does it say this method MUST work because it's the Word of God? Actually, it anticipates that SOME will NOT listen, regardless of whether the proper steps are taken. Have known preachers who did NOT listen, regardless of warning. In fact, failing that step means the offender must be excommunicated, regarded by the church as a Gentile and a tax collector. The idea is not merely to punish the offender or to shun him completely, but to remove him as a detrimental influence from the fellowship of the church. Not hearing the church is hard-hearted impenitence. He won't repent - MacArthur Study Bible.
Anonymous says, "What kind of love would allow a maniac, false prophet, liar and gangsta to continue to mislead others?" So I guess we are to FORCE him down, huh? Suppose to excommunicate him, but what if he chooses to stay? Should we call the police? You tell me. Like we can make the man HEAR us? Vote him out, maybe? What if the man stacks the vote by recruiting non-church members? What kind of love would allow a man like this to stay? Is there any care for the flock? Or are we devoted to the man instead of Christ? We know how Christ feels about an undershepherd dividing His flock. What about you?
"Time for church folk to stop covering up?" Covering up what? I thought my blog on minister or maniac exposed the problem, which is the whole point of your response/post, correct?
"Walking away from sin?" WOW. So, you're telling me, with sin in the camp, we should stay and deal with it? But I thought that we are supposed to depart from evil (cf. Psalm 34:14) Isn't departing from evil the fear of the LORD? Am I to sacrifice my reverence for God by "dealing" with sin? Show me a text that teaches me we should engage sin and not avoid it.
1 Peter 3:9-11. Interesting text, considering that Peter wrote in a context of Roman persecution. He is telling us to bless those who are revilers, not those who are saved....though that does apply. Are we assuming the preacher is a non-Christian? Or is he a Christian? Because if he is a Christian, then he is to be brought into accountability. You are right...we are to have a humble and loving attitude towards EVERYONE, but that does not mean we gloss over sin. Like I said, if I am guilty...I expect a spanking. We ARE to pursue peace. You're RIGHT. But Romans 12:18 says, "If it be possible, as much that lieth in you, live peaceably with all men." Some preachers are not seeking peace. They are seeking subordinates. In other words, "Do what I say," even if what he says, violates the Scripture.
Can't get with you on that one, my brother or sister.
Nevertheless, my prayers are with you and with the ministers.
Blessings.
Alright I agree with some of what u said, but if this problem that u have so called addressed refers to a particular preacher or minister u should just come out and say who it is and exactly what the problem is without all this cover up. Secondly, dont try to come bk with the word with some reason for not exposing the name, because pretty much u r already discussing the matter publicly, but almost deceitfully so people want know who u r talking about except for those who may associate in the circle that u do. Tell precisely what the pastor did what evidence u have( notice I said evidence not he say she say) and talk about rather or not God told u to leave the church and rather or not u gave his reason or your own. No disrespect intended and nothing personal, but if there is a problem u need to come out and say it and not cover it up through an in general blog. God bless
ReplyDeleteAnonymous...
ReplyDeleteHere we go again.
"If this problem that you have so called addressed refers to a particular preacher or minister u should just come out and say who it is."
First of all, who said I was talking about a particular preacher? Or did you make that assumption on your own? And do you really take me for a fool that I would expose a particular preacher for all the world to see? What would make me different from the media? Heard of the Eddie Long story? How do we feel about that one? How is the church being affected by that news?
"Secondly, don't try to come bk with the word with some reason for not exposing the name."
Don't try to come back with the Word, huh? Interesting, since you posted a comment in your original post from 1 Peter 3:9-11? Look familiar? Check out your original post. So, who's coming at who with the Word? Hypocrite. No matter is being discussed publicly. Furthermore, what MATTER are we talking about? Since you want specifics, why don't you tell me what you THINK I'm talking about, since you FEEL I'm already out of line.
"Almost deceitfully."
Interesting coming from a person called Anonymous. Who's being deceptive? Who's hiding behind an "Anonymous" and won't come out and say who YOU are? Why let me burn out here by myself. Speak up! Show yourself. No need...because I already KNOW who you are, ANONYMOUS. But I won't expose that either. I'm not a coward. I'm ready and willing to fight for the faith and to defend my Lord's honor. That's why you see my NAME on this blog, not an ANONYMOUS.
"Associate in the circle that u do."
What circle is that? Why don't you come out and tell me what circle I travel in, since you claim that I should come out and tell WHO the pastor is and WHAT he did.
"What evidence you have (not he say or she say)"
Wow. Interesting. Providing that I am talking about a PARTICULAR preacher, according to your accusation(evidence that you have not come forward with, only speculation that I am talking about someone particular), suppose the gossip the preacher is spreading is he say she say? What about HIS or HER evidence?
"And talk about rather or not God told u to leave the church and rather or not u gave his reason or your own."
You've exposed yourself again, ANONYMOUS. Where in this post did I say "I" left a particular church? All my post says is that good people have gone, Godly people have gone. Are you assuming that I left, or is that another he say, she say thing? Is it your interpretation that I left or did I specify that? Before you talk, check your facts.
"No disrespect intended"
None taken.
"Nothing personal"
I wonder. I find it interesting that you would post your defense for someone you obviously don't believe is guilty. If YOUR particular preacher isn't guilty, then what's all the fuss about? Why come at me like I am attacking one of your personal friends?
And you can always feel free to contact me and we can discuss it. Or will you remain ANONYMOUS?
"General blog"
No, the blog is Church Folk Can Be Dangerous People." Sounds pretty specific to me, and to all my other readers.
God bless you too.
Woah. There are two different anonymous responses from two different people.
ReplyDeleteCool.
ReplyDeleteSeems we have another Anonymous blogger. Now, would that make you Anonymous #3? (Smile) Don't wish to assume, but wish to give you the benefit of the doubt.
I do have a couple of questions, however. Your post said there are two different people under the pseudonym, Anonymous. And you came to this understanding based on what? Please....share your thoughts. How did you determine these are 2 different people? I certainly didn't get that from the reading both posts, and neither did a few of my readers.
Another question. What means are you using to verify your conclusion? Do you have IP addresses confirming these posts came from two different workstations? Have you had any contact with the TWO bloggers, confirming it's not the same person?
Would love to hear how you came to this conclusion. Would also appreciate if you added to the conversation within this blog entry.
Other than that, I pray that everything is good with you.
Blessings.
anonymous 1
ReplyDeleteI wrote the first anonymous response! And someone else I dont know piggy backed on that! So not three anonymous responders but only two. But I will respond to your comments and try to keep it brief.
Which office is held more accountable to God? Well obviously you know the answer but you never really addressed my comment about showing more respect. Surely if the president should not be talked about, a minister deserves higher reverence. If it is not ok to wish death on a president, it can't be ok to call a man of God such names as liar, demon, maniac, false prophet, and so on. Or are you saying that is cool? Even if such statements are true there must be a better way to deal with it as I suggested by the scriptures.
As far as misquoting them. THEY CAN'T FAIL. I did not mean that the minister would necessarily listen and change but that by following those steps, any wrong doing would be properly exposed and then the body would be properly warned of his behaviors and have the proper knowledge. From that point God has it! God will not fail to do his part when we handle matters the way he said to handle them.
About letting him continue to mislead others. Again you did not address the point behind my comment. If a man of God is doing all those things and good Godly people just leave, they are leaving behind innocent and unaware babes. Even sheep let out a cry when they see danger approaching, even though they are running while they scream!
Covering up and walking away from sin. Well you are not really exposing anything. We all already know that some men of God are not called and some that are called fall. The news is full of that. In most of the cases we heard about in the media going back to the Catholic church abuse scandal, members of the clergy knew what was happening and either did not tell or walked away. Nobody stood up and said anything to protect those children. All I am saying is that if there is sin in the camp YES we are to deal with it. Are you saying if there is sin in your house, you would avoid it, or even worse just leave, of course not. Almost every prophet in the Bible was sent for the purpose of uncovering and dealing with sin, you know that. Jesus himself came and died for our sins. He exposed it (Pharisees, Judas, Peter), and dealt with it, death. You want scripture: Gal 6:1, 1 Cor 5:1-13. And let’s not get lost in the context but also consider the application when responding.
One final comment. Your blog has the subtitle, “How to successfully interact with spiritual pretenders.” In all your responses not once did I read how you suggest this minister, who you obviously feel is pretending, should be dealt with. Unless of course you are saying prayer is our only recourse.
I will say this on the back end since I did not on the front, my only purpose for responding is to edify. People of God need to stand up and stop letting the devil run free course. God has given us the power and authority through Christ to resist satan. His most successful scheme is that of DECEPTION. And through that DECEPTION he causes division. Did it in the garden still doing it today. Love, joy, and peace to you all.
Post #1
ReplyDeleteAnonymous 1
Point taken. We see there are only two. Understood. Now, I will address your latest post. Please take it in the spirit it is given.
First concerning your comment about showing more respect. I have the ultimate respect for "qualified" pastors. No question. Let me give you a list...My pastor, Pastor R.A. Frazier, my father in the ministry, Pastor G.L. Williams out of Jacksonville, my father-in-law, Pastor Brookins Sr, my dad, Sidney Sr., Pastor/Bible teacher John MacArthur, Pastor David Jeremiah, Pastor R.C. Sproul Sr., Pastor John Piper, Pastor/Teacher Dan Doriani, Pastor R.A. Williams. I have a plethora of "qualified" pastors I could mention and I wouldn't think of reverencing the President more than them.
However, I have learned there is a difference between a "man of God" and a preacher. Anybody can preach. Grab a text, a microphone and start talking. But a "man of God" exhibits the character of God. As far as referencing liars, demons, maniacs and false prophets, please don't get my comments twisted. I wasn't talking about a "man of God." I was talking about so-called preachers. Satan has ministers too, precisely who I'm speaking of (cf. 2 Cor. 11:12-15). You said you suggested Scriptures, but what about other Biblical passages you may have left out? And what makes an overseer in the church "unqualified?" Well...Scripture is my source of authority (cf. 1 Timothy 3:1-7) Any blatant violation of this heavy list of qualifications disqualifies him/her as an effective overseer. Don't have time or space to deal with this passage in depth, but we get the point.
As far as you saying THEY CAN'T FAIL, I agree that God won't. No argument there at all. You say I misinterpreted your statement. I could say the same thing. That wasn't the point I aimed to argue. We KNOW God will do His part, but man won't, which means unless God miraculously removes the offender, the offender will still wreak havoc in the church. Guess we'll both have to wait on God to do something about that. Point taken.
You mentioned about good and Godly people leaving behind innocent and unaware babes, correct? Well...what about the innocent and unaware babes the "unqualified" pastor offended and ran out of the church? And please don't say the Word drove them out. Not so. The ones who left the church with their hearts ripped out and who now question God's character because of what God's representative did to them. This ruins God's reputation and He won't stand for it. Neither will I. What about THOSE sheep?
Are they less important? Or do you consider them goats because they left? I thought a "man of God" - according to Matthew 18:12-13 - would leave his ninety-nine sheep to go find one who strayed, just like a good shepherd Jesus is describing in this passage? And then rejoices when he finds the sheep. Are they the "little" ones the preacher has despised? Has the preacher searched them out, or has he said, "Good riddance." Are these sheep not screaming, as you pointed out about the "innocent and unaware" babes? What about them?
Post #2 (continued)
ReplyDeleteAs far as the Catholic church abuse scandal, members of the clergy should have called the authorities. Not only is sexual abuse of a minor a violation of God's moral law, it violates civil law. You want to protect children, you place them in protective custody in a case like that. Can't speak for them. I know what I would have done. You end that paragraph saying we are to deal with sin. Well, should we deal with sin the same way Joshua dealt with Achan? (cf. Joshua 7). Would you suggest killing the preacher and his family? Oh I know...that is Old Testament; but if sin is that serious, serious measures should be taken right? Deal with it, right, according to your own admission?
As far as sin in the house, your comment doesn't make much sense to me. So, if you have a drug dealing son who has turned your home into a dope house, do you deal with it? Or do you put him out? Whether it's leaving or putting him out, the bottom line is separation. If you don't, you'll be in prison with him. That is how you deal with that. The Feds don't play. Visit them sometime, and you'll see. Grandmothers living out their senior years in prison for "dealing" with a drug selling grandson. Now, that's real.
Or what about spousal abuse? Do you deal with a man putting his hands on his woman every chance he gets? Beating her to a pulp? That kind of physical abuse is just as much sin as anything else. So, what does a woman do? Stay and deal with it? She'll die. Any preacher who encourages her to bare up is crazy and isn't fit for leadership.
So, how would you suggest "dealing" with an overseer who believes he/she is above correction? Can't tell him/her nothing. THEY are the pastors, right? What do you do? No man is above correction. Pride leads to his/her destruction.
Now, your Scriptures concerning uncovering and dealing with sin are interesting. Yes, the prophets and Jesus exposed sin. We agree. But it's one thing to expose sin; fellowshipping with it is something altogether different. I'll deal with Gal. 6:1 in a second. Apparently you didn't read the passage you suggested in 1 Cor. 5:1-13. First of all, the passage is dealing with sexual immorality, but we'll talk about "context" in a second. But you gave me a passage concerning dealing with sin and right in the middle of the passage (vs. 11), the Scripture tells us to avoid such people. I'm confused. You're telling me to stay and deal with it, but the text you gave me tells me to avoid it. Which one is it?
Galatians 6:1 speaks about someone being overtaken in A fault. It speaks of a person being caught in the snare of A sin. I have blogged minister or maniac concerning habitual ill-behavior. When it's a habit, this is no longer a fault. It's willful disobedience. David calls it presumptious sin, something he wanted to be kept back from (cf. Psalm 19:13).
Post #3 (continued)
ReplyDelete"Let's not get lost in the context?" Whoa. Anyone who seriously studies Scripture knows that context rules interpretation. It's the basic rule of Biblical hermeneutics, that is the art and science of interpretation. It's a science because certain rules apply and these rules are classified in an orderly system. It's an art because one has to communicate the text to a variety of people, with different backgrounds, milieu, culture, pedigree, etc... There are a few gaps the observer needs to uncover. That is, historical gap, cultural gap, linguistic gap and philosophical gap.
You speak about application. How can you apply a prooftext? That is to interpret without paying attention to the context surrounding the verse you claim you're applying? Before we can apply Scripture, we need to know what it meant to its original readers. What did the author INTEND when he wrote his passage? The Word can never mean what it never meant. It's not what "it says to ME," it's "what does it say?"
Illustration: If I say, "Grab the trunk." What do I mean? What am I talking about? The stem of a tree? Luggage used for traveling or storage? The body, excluding the head, neck and limbs? A compartment at the rear of a car? An elephant's snout? Or someone's backside? Without "CONTEXT" - what you say I shouldn't get lost in - how do I apply the statement "Grab the trunk?" You can't. So, please don't quote Scriptures out of context (prooftext) telling me to apply them.
And yes, my post DID say what should be done concerning this minister, and it came from the very first passage YOU quoted. It's called excommunication. But I get it, not something we do here in 2010. But in the first century church, it happened all the time.
I end this LONG comment with DECEPTION. You're right. The devil DOES deceive. And you're right again...he causes division. So, let me ask you this, Anonymous 1. Are you above being deceived? If you say you are, then are you saying the Godly people who left the "innocent and unaware" babes have fallen prey to Satanic deception? My question then is what constitutes THEM being deceived and YOU being clear? Is that pride to elevate your spirituality over someone else by making a judgment call? If you say "No, I'm not above being deceived." then is it POSSIBLE that YOU have been duped and those who left the "innocent and unaware babes" are clear? Because if the Godly people who left are the ones deceived and the ones who let the devil use them to cause divisions - since you brought up DECEPTION - then that should help the "innocent & unaware babes" in their Christian growth. The problem children are gone. Or should the DECEIVED ones stay and DEAL with sin to help the innocent babes?
And yes, he did it in the Garden and Eve played the arbitrator. She chose to listen to another "voice" instead of God's voice. So, if you are suggesting I listen to YOUR voice and DEAL with sin, when God said to avoid it, what would make me any different than Eve?
Blessings.
My Brother it appears that the "anonymous's" one, two or three or however many they may be are excellent candiates (cowards) for the Jim Jones/David Karesh followers. The Lord shows Himself strong on behalf of those whose heart is loyal to Him (2 Chronicles 16:9) - Your words are the proof of your strength Scribe. Tell it and tell it again for there is always hope for the lost. And if not - run....Forest..... run.
ReplyDelete(cont..) All the same though, I believe that we should do what God has prospered us to do according to his word and nothing more. There is a lot more that I have to say but for the sake of time I wont. I just pray that we all learn how to sincerely pray for each other as your new blog suggest and leave the rest to God. If these pastors are wrong I am sure they know it and if they know enough about God I am sure they know they will not get away with it. God is the same yesterday, today, and forevermore and can handle any problem in the church and in our lives much better than we can.
ReplyDeleteBy the way I was not specifically talking to you, when I said " think we have it all together," I was simply saying that at some pts. in our lives all christians admittedly can see the wrong in others, but fail to see the wrong in ourselves.
P.S. I would be carful with running right in and attacking those that don't appear to agree with you. (just and observation). God bless you, I love you all the same (it is my responsibility) and once again pray this is not taken personal... ref. Eccl 12:14, Psalms 30:6-12, Matthew 5:9,11-12; Matthew 7:13-19(I have seen alot of good fruit);Matthew 12:33-37; Matthew 18:11-20(I think we skipped the last step as you said you did not feel the need to publicly rebuke, but what did God say he did not say take 2 and then walk away.... Selah); Matthew 5:23,24,43-48.ment cont...
wicked(if indeed they are)
ReplyDeleteBack again. But I assure all my readers, this is my final note on this post. I made my point clear, but there still seems to be confusion. So, I will answer this then leave it alone.
ReplyDeleteTLC
First off, I never called you a coward. I don't control other bloggers, so maybe you should address the blogger who said it. And everyone has issues. What's your point? Your 2nd paragraph said you did not identify yourself the second time around because of baby Christians reading the blog. Well...how would baby Christians, and mature ones for that matter, be able to determine who T.L.C is? Is that clear? Is that Tender, Loving Care? What about T-Boz, Left Eye (RIP) and Chilli? Are you speaking on behalf of the Discovery Channel, TLC? And how can I frown at someone I don't even know? So, whether you were TLC or anonymous, same effect. I'm still not clear on your identity. But I don't need to know that.
But since you brought it up, I'll address something you said in your Anonymous #2 post. You said, "People want to know who you are talking about?" I'd like to know who you THINK I'm talking about, since you seem convinced I am speaking of someone specific. And if you BELIEVE it's someone specific, what is your justification? Guilty conscience? No name was mentioned, so how do you know for sure I'm referencing someone you might know, unless those tendencies are there? I can be talking about someone in El Segundo for all we know. I've met hundreds of preachers who have the same virtues I posted in Minister or Maniac. What logical reason do you have for thinking I'm talking about someone you know?
I'd like to know who you really are? But you won't go there, will you? Yet, you demand I inform you about an identity? Is that hypocritical? Don't know, you tell me. As far as the people are concerned, didn't the PEOPLE get Saul in trouble? Didn't the PEOPLE get Moses in trouble? Didn't the PEOPLE push Aaron to make a golden calf? And each time God's judgment came down like a hammer. Think I'm catching the same whoopin' they did? Not so. Seems to me you might be one of those PEOPLE fishing for information than what the blog suggests. Then again, we all have issues, right? Maybe I'm wrong about that.
You said what caused you to post in the first place was something I said. Of course, you misquoted me again. I never said I "witnessed" anything disgusting. Go back and read it. And please tell me you've never seen a crackpot clergyman? If that's the case, then every preacher is representing God to the fullest. Then how do you explain Satan's ministers? Jim Jones? David Koresh? As LesRee stated. And what about that Heaven's Gate nutcase? All those kids wearing Nike shoes with towels over their heads, trying to catch the tail end of a Hale-Bop Comet? Are not these crackpot ministers? So-called preachers who manipulated people to their deaths? Since these exploits are clearly documented, why the anger on my comments about crackpots?
Post #2
ReplyDeleteRecruiting votes? That presumption is a lie, you argue? If that is specific, you argue. Who said it was? Are other PEOPLE pointing out someone SPECIFIC? Because I didn't. And if other PEOPLE are pointing fingers at someone SPECIFIC, you need to address THEM, not ME.
And what is your definition of innocent sheep? Who's really innocent? I simply piggy-backed off the Anonymous blogger, never said we were out of the woods. No one is innocent. Everyone is guilty of death. And yes, I trust God to fight every battle...and I'm STILL not hanging around sin. Take that in any way you choose.
Bluntly disrespecting the preacher? Did you read my post about "preachers" and "men of God?" Have you read Jude? Let's see...filthy dreamers (vs. 8) Brute beasts? (vs. 10) Clouds without water? (vs. 12). And what about Paul in Acts 13 when rebuking Elymas, the sorcerer? "O full of all subtlety and all mischief, thou child of the devil, thou enemy of all righteousness? (cf. Acts 13:10). He was a teacher/preacher is you will...A false prophet in fact (cf. Acts 13:6). Would you call that blunt disrespect?
The problem with contemporary Christendom is sworn allegiance to the man, and not Christ. If it's all about Christ, then it's all about His Word. And if someone is violating His Word - preacher or layperson - the Word tells us what to do. Not gonna get into another exegesis and hermeneutics lesson on properly interpreting Scripture...done that already.
You said, "I have seen a lot of people leave the church, but none of them have said one thing that the pastor has done. I dont know, maybe according to your blog you are saying he is prideful? I have heard some say that they dont feel like he is a great overseer or they would have or would have not done things a certain way"
Again...who is this "he" that you're referring to? And what church are you saying people left from? None of that was ever mentioned in this blog. Now, who is sounding more specific? Is it me or is it you? Just a question.
Post #3 (continued)
ReplyDeleteI agree with you as far as praying earnestly, and like you, I have a great deal more to say, but I will keep it under wraps. As far as seeing wrong in others, I'm the kind of brother who demands people step to me when I'm wrong. But it needs to be wrong according to the Scriptures, not according to how somebody feels.
You said, "P.S. I would be carful with running right in and attacking those that don't appear to agree with you. (just and observation)."
Well...TLC...did you observe that YOU ran right in and attacked me because I don't appear to agree with YOU?" So, seems you've just contradicted yourself.
God bless you too. Much love, much peace to you. Don't have the time to exegete your "suggested" Scriptures...will be here until 2012.